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Tuesday, September 28, 2010

Hudud: Maybe RPK Should Think Before He Writes

Raja Petra went to town attacking the PAS Youth Chief for suggesting Hudud as an alternative. My initial response is : AT LEAST SOMEONE IS THINKING OF A SOLUTION TO THE WORSENING CRIME PROBLEM in Malaysia.

Instead of providing a sound alternative, RPK chose to redicule the PAS Youth Chief.

He went to cite the failure of Christian laws in Europe from the history of Christianity. The trouble with this argument is that the same cannot be said about Islamic laws or Hudud. The Islamic Penal Code has been in practiced for 1400 years and NO ONE complained about it's implementation.

The removal of Islamic Penal Code from the lives of Muslims are mostly the handiwork of Colonials like British, Russians, France, Belgium, Dutch etc when Muslim Lands were invaded by them.

In fact, in India, women were prevented from getting inheritence from their fathers because the Common Law of Britain forbids any inheritance to women, at that time, when British first invaded India. For a few hundred years before that women were getting inheritance without any hinderance because they were subjected to Shariah Laws.

So, there lies Raja Petra's main weakness in his argument: he cites examples from the history of CHRISTIANITY which DIFFERS greatly from the history of Islam and Islamic Penal Code.

As far as history has shown, Islamic Penal Code is practiced by Muslims for the last 1400 years and no one complained about it despite the coming and going of Muslim rulers throughout the ages.

So, i beg Raja Petra to come up with a better argument to negate the effectiveness of Islamic Penal Code.

Oh, and Raja Petra also made this argument:

If this is true then why quote the example of the murder of Datuk Sosilawati Lawiya? This woman was allegedly killed by Indian Hindus, not by Malay Muslims. And since Hudud applies only to Muslims then it does not matter whether Malaysia does or does not implement these Islamic laws. It would not have deterred these Indian Hindus from killing Datuk Sosilawati Lawiya because they would have been exempted from these laws anyway.


It so happens, the crime of murder falls under QISAS and not HUDUD. And trust me, anyone would agree to QISAS regardless of their religion.

As for me, if a Jewish gentleman name Noah Feldman who actually thinks that Islamic Penal Code is good and practical.

Funny, a guy like RPK who claims to be Muslims, giving hell about Islamic laws while a Jewish professor from Harvard wrote and article in the New York TImes to defend the Shariah.

How the world has turned upside down. DId I mention the Jewish guy is a professor of law from Harvard.

Tulang Besi

ps i've written before about Raja Petra's shallowness in understanding Islam and the Islamic Penal Code. No matter what RPK says, majority Muslims supports the Shariah and wants it's implementation. Hell, even in Britain, the Shariah is being practiced albeit still limited.

21 comments:

ZIK said...

Good arguments..I maybe support RPK but I declined his view on syariah laws!!RPK should at least discuss the matter with Youth PAS Leader instead of riduculing him..this's one of the right for Muslim..while we respect other community right to express and practised their religion why the hack we're forbidden to do the same??!!

Grand Marquis said...

TB, bukankah RPK ni hang punya idola? Hari-hari hang cite dia. Bila RPK bohong, hang kata dia betul. Dalam artikel hudud, ada part-part yang tak betul, tapi kalau kita nilai secara kritis, 70% argument beliau betul. Isu yang dibangkitkan ialah sistem perundangan apa pun akan gagal sekiranya manusia yang mendukung sistem itu korup.

TB dalam nak bagi hujah balas pun tak kemana hujahnya. Hanya sekadar bermodalkan 1400 years and no no complained about it. Is that all the best you can do TB? Kalau aku jadi RPK dan nak counter balik, memang hang akan kena KO.

Tantawi dan TB ni adalah sama kelibatnya. Masing-masing cuba jadi hero tanpa berfikir masak-masak. Keluar hujah separuh masak untuk nak jadi hero. Bila kena counter argument dan tak boleh jawab balik, Islam akan jadi mangsa fitnah.

TB kata AT LEAST SOMEONE IS THINKING OF A SOLUTION TO THE WORSENING CRIME PROBLEM in Malaysia.

Cuba korang fikir, kalau Non-Muslim baca artikel Tantawi, lepas tu RPK, korang rasa non-Muslim tu fikir apa? Adakah mereka akan fikir Islam and Hudud will be a solution? Or they will think it will create more problem?

Anonymous said...

Hahaha bukan RPK ni idola ko ke. Hahahahaha..

waras said...

cetek punya penyokong dumbno,jangan bandingkan permikiran org sama dengan kau.grand marquis pergi bercampur la dengan dunia luar

Anonymous said...

'Sistem perundangan bagus macam mana pun tak jalan kalau manusia mendokong sistem itu korup'. Manusia semakin ramai jadi korup kerana apa? Sebab pendidikan ke? persekitaran ke ? perundangan ke?
Siapa dan pihak mana yg mempunyai kuasa paling tinggi yg boleh membentuk pendidikan, persekitaran yg menwujudkan manusia tidak korup. Panduan atau manual sudah ada, perlaksanaan tiada mungkin tiada will atau tiada soul yg sudah mati dimakan materialistik ?

PASti

Anonymous said...

Bro,RPK is a cukoo bird..he is a looney who thinks he can create a 3rd force(using the sultans,hindraf,zaid ibrahim??) to change the political landscape of this country..this jack s anglo hybrid qualifications is probably up2 O levels.. due to his connections with the elites,he did some funky whealing n dealing(like any typical umno pundek) and made some money,and he thinks his beer buddies n anglo retards r the ultimate species in Malaysia..his failure after failure(due to his monster ego,stupidity,n desire to be mr somebody like che det guava) is making him crazier..so sorry for him..once upon a time,this che guave jus had some principal(powered by the desire to be a macho hero)..2day,he is a fugitive,living in his secular mother land which is fast becoming a 4th world,with zero money and trillions of unpayable debts..

MBI said...

tahniah TB, w.pn RPK idola anda, tp bila bab agama anda berani menegur..sebagai seorang islam kita wajib mengambil undang-undang jenayah & qada' yg telah ditetapkan oleh Islam, menyokong pelaksanaannya..

aku tak paham kenapa GM hentam anda & tantawi, kononnya boleh counter sampai KO dan katanya islam mangsa fitnah akibat artikel ini, tetapi GM lupa adalah teramat hina apabila org islam sendiri (baca RPK & GM)teramg-terangan menolak hudud dan tak ubah seperti mahafiraun (maybe GM secularist or islam hadhari hadari & 1 malaysia)

ZIK, said...

Bodohpunya orang UMNO...kalu Idola TB pun x semestinya semua hujah dan pandangan RPK dia setuju..tapi ahli umnongok..kalu Najib lulus judi diam macam batang kayu padahal tau benda tu haram!!!apa sal korang tak tentang Najib..nasib baiklah ada UMNO jOHOR..adalah sikit respek aku kat UMNO Johor..PPSMI pun diorang tentang..harap negeri lain pakai jadi pak angguk lee!!!Ni hujung tahun ni nak naik tol lagi..apa keja korang..angguk je le kut!! aku tau ramai ahli umno biasa kat bawah tu gaji cukup2 makan bkn macam YB2 kau dan Ketua Cawangan!!

Alham said...

Salam,Tuan,

Your argument has some truth but its a bit too shallow to really qualify as a decent reply.

If u don't mind I would propose that u write in Malay instead, as i spotted quite a few mistakes in the posting.

RPK would see your point rather than u be ridiculed by his followers due to a rather weak in the command of English langauge.

Anonymous said...

seronok baca komen yang mengutuk TB...

non-Muslim said...

"NO ONE complained about it's implementation."

Tulang Besi, that is a tremendous sweeping statement - no one complained? Have you asked a non-Muslim?

Anonymous said...

Oi grand moron...ko ni bila ada artikel camni baru berani nk komen kn..yg xmampu ko nk jwb xberani nk komen lak...TB dulu pernah condemn RPK psl anti hadith...ko baca ke x...xpn ko ni mmg dr keturunan bangang...kalau ko pandai ko tgk balik artikel2 lama TB yg bantai RPK psl bende ni...mmg betul le org kata ko ni moron...bukan moron je...bangang nk mampos pn ada...hahaha...kesian GM aka GRAND MORON...

Anonymous said...

//"NO ONE complained about it's implementation."

Tulang Besi, that is a tremendous sweeping statement - no one complained? Have you asked a non-Muslim?//

helo jack s ben dumbo..what dia napoleon do when he conqueroed egypt?Biasa dengar tak "Code Napoleon"?What was the state of affairs in europe prior to napoleaon? Dear dungu,democracy and socialsm's birthplace was Asialah..even greece falsafah was imported frm India(the birth place of socialism during the vedic/upanishadic period)..and the seeds of modern democracy came with the birth of islam(eventhough Prophet Mumammad real mission was to make people realise SOUL DEMOCRACY/EQUALITY.. 1st principle: all in one..2nd principle:one in all.. 3rd principle:evolving,realising,manifesting the 1st n 2nd fused together)..in the quran,its VERY CLEAR THE MESSAGE OF THE DIVINE'S CONCENTRATION OF ONENESS AND DECLARING THE TWIN POWERS OF STATIC AND DYNAMIC FUSED TOGETHER IN ONENESS!!..ASIATIC LIFE HAS ALWAYS BEEN ON THE PRINCIPALS OF DIVINE'S PRINCIPALS AND TRUTH..EUROPEAN LAWS ARE BASED ON MENTAL GYMNASTICS AND EGO..HABIS CERITA!!

AND YOU CAN KEEP YOUR MUSLIM NON MUSLIMISM IN YOUR PUNGKOQ FOR ETERNITY!

Grand Marquis said...

Nik
..kalu Najib lulus judi diam macam batang kayu padahal tau benda tu haram!!!apa sal korang tak tentang Najib..

Yang banyak bantah judi bola hari tu juga orang UMNO dan blog-blog UMNO.

Cuma hairan bila Lim Guan Eng sebat duit judi, puak pakatan senyap seribu bahasa.

Non-Muslim
Tulang Besi, that is a tremendous sweeping statement - no one complained? Have you asked a non-Muslim?

See, I told you, such a shallow argument. TB terkenal membuat konklusi dari hujah tanpa basis. Dia suka kata "semua" bla bla bla seperti dia tahu hati semua manusia.

Isu disini ialah kalau sendiri jahil dan argument tak kuat, jangan cuba berlagak jadi hero. Kelak Islam terfitnah akibat perbuatan orang-orang yang jahil. Dalam Quran suruh bertanya pada ahli zikir (orang berilmu) kalau tak tau, bukannya berlagak jadi hero.

Tulang Besi said...


Yang banyak bantah judi bola hari tu juga orang UMNO dan blog-blog UMNO.

Cuma hairan bila Lim Guan Eng sebat duit judi, puak pakatan senyap seribu bahasa.


Yang lulus lesen judi UMNO jugak hahahahaha

Ertinya tindakan blog2 UMNO tu semua SANDIWARA


Hahahahahaha

Anonymous said...

Grand Mairendi aka GM is RPK's gay partner kot..its very clearlah now.. looney pootra used d words "indian hindus" shows he has always been hamba/toady 2 dat pariah malayali dravida Mahaptuih kutty..looney pootra, najubori and maha chunni kutty ada banyak persamaan..they r impatient,volatile n impulsive,pondan cum coward,ego besar,suka act macho,suka dipandang tinggi,BODOH!

Anonymous said...

Gunning for Islam

The Islamophobes: fringe wackos, or rising mass movement?
by Justin Raimondo, September 13, 2010

Three people are dead because US "pastor" Terry Jones, in collaboration with the American media, staged (or threatened to stage) an anti-Muslim Koran-burning exhibition, which predictably stoked anti-American protests in Afghanistan: also predictably, US troops fired on demonstrators. The result: yet more "collateral damage."

In more 9/11 anniversary news: a rally sponsored by the David Horowitz-affiliated "Jihad Watch," in alliance with Pamela "Shrieking Harpy" Geller’s "Stop the Islamization of America" grouplet and the British neo-fascist "English Defense League," attracted a few thousand wackos to a site a few blocks from Ground Zero, where uber-wacko Geert Wilders (Dutch neo-fascist and leading Islamophobe) made the case for banning Islam in the name of … "Dutch tolerance":"America, New York and Shariah are incompatible in New York. New York stands for openness and tolerance. Suppose there was a place and it only allowed people of one persuasion within its walls. It would not be New York. It would be Mecca."

Anonymous said...

This is the kind of person at the head of the "anti-Islamization" movement – an escaped war criminal.

Pantano is now running for Congress in North Carolina — as a Republican, naturally.

Joe Conason made an important point about this hate movement, and that is its intensely partisan nature. Go here to listen to hate-monger Geller, aka Pamela Oshry, at a pro-Israel rally earlier this year. She ends her ultra-Likudist diatribe – "There is no Israeli occupation: the Arabs are occupying Israel!" – by urging her audience to "Dump Chuck!" Chuck Schumer, that is, the Democratic US Senator from New York who "dared" oppose John Bolton’s nomination for UN ambassador: after all, "reasons" Geller, Bolton is "the best friend Israel ever had!" What else do we need to know?

If you think this gathering of pro-Israel fanatics, British football hooligans, and a Dutch neo-fascist is just a fringe phenomenon, ask yourself how many Americans believe Obama is a "secret Muslim"? The answer is depressing: and Republicans like Newt Gingrich are already using the anti-Muslim hysteria to target the President and his party in a display of shameless opportunism that is a new low, even for the GOP.

Part of this is due to internal Republican party politics: with the economics-driven "tea party" faction rapidly overturning the GOP Establishment, the neoconservative remnants are trying to stage a comeback by diverting the movement’s energy to anti-Muslim scapegoating — anything other than holding Republicans as well as Democrats accountable for spending us into penury.

Anonymous said...

The impetus for this comes, as I detailed in last Friday’s column, from the pro-Israel lobby, which is moving into high gear with its bomb Iran campaign, with Bolton calling on both the US and Israel to launch an immediate military strike. Millions of dollars are being poured into this effort, with Spencer’s "Jihad Watch" and various and sundry other pro-Israel groups on the receiving end of the moolah. Like many right-wing movements, the anti-Islam activists have founded a new industry, marketing books, videos, and t-shirts, and throwing up "celebrities," e.g. the exhibitionistic bikini-wearing Geller, whose nude body painted gold adorns her blog’s masthead. Follow the money!

As nutty and improbable as the idea of an "Islamic States of America" might be, there is real potential for a mass anti-Muslim movement in this country. All we need is another terrorist attack, not even one on the scale of 9/11, and the smoldering fires of unfocused anger that burn just beneath the surface of polite society will burst through to the surface. Ask any Japanese-American.

Languishing for the lack of a proper enemy in the post-cold war world, the neoconservative right was saved from extinction by the 9/11 terrorist attacks. The specter of militant Islam is, for them, the perfect villain, one who represents a threat not just to the US but also to Israel, a country which is to them as the old Soviet Union was to American Communists: a model and a fatherland. Their strategy is to replicate in the US the anti-Muslim xenophobia that swept Likud into power in Israel, and which has catapulted Avigdor Lieberman, head of an anti-Muslim ultra-nationalist party, into the Foreign Ministry. Bolton is our Lieberman, and hopes to take the same route to power.

Anonymous said...

"I don’t think anybody has a problem with Muslims in America," opines Reason.com editor Nick Gillespie on PBS. Is that why the anti-mosque campaign has gone national, and with some success? Is that why "mainstream" Republican politicians like Newt Gingrich and Speaker John Boehner are weighing in against the Park51 community center? Is it because there’s never been a mass political movement in America targeting a vulnerable religious minority?

I’d like to believe these people won’t get far: after all, how many Americans feel threatened by the possible imposition of Sharia law? On the other hand, it takes very little to drive people over the edge, especially in these troubled times.

The only way to defeat these bastards is to counter-attack immediately, and mercilessly: don’t let them get away with it for one moment. The very idea of forbidding the building of a mosque, or any religious edifice, is anti-American to the core, and must be fought tooth and nail. What could be a clearer confirmation of the libertarian contention that a foreign policy of global intervention necessarily means the rollback of our civil liberties here at home? For libertarians, there is no question but that Muslims must be defended against the gathering lynch mob.

How to do this is another question, but that’s a subject for a future column. Suffice to say here that the defense of the Muslim minority in the US is the acid test for all those who claim to believe in "freedom" and "liberty."

Anonymous said...

ahh... tulang besi dan RPK
sama-sama mangkuk ayun ...

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